FIFA World Cup 2014, Brazil

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Re: FIFA World Cup 2014, Brazil

Postby sameerph » Sat Jul 05, 2014 5:28 am

Yes, Brazil & Germany are thru. With Neymar out and their captain Silva also missing next match due to 2 yellow cards, I would give Germany the edge in the SF. This is their fourth consecutive world cup semi final and I think this time they have a very good chance of making the final. Germany have a huge array of talent in midfield and frontline with Muller, Klose, Podolski, Ozil, Schweinsteiger, Gotze. Their is one team which is not dependent on 1 or 2 players but defense is weak. If they are to be overcome that as they did against France, they can win the title.

I also have a liking for Argentina from Maradonna days and now with Messi. But, they have looked great so far in their matches. Others around Messi will have to play better if they have to go forward.

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Re: FIFA World Cup 2014, Brazil

Postby Atithee » Sat Jul 05, 2014 5:41 am

PKBasu wrote:Neymar is out of the World Cup after a vicious knee tackle caused him to break his vertebra. The offender didn't even receive a yellow card!!

I think Brazil will still beat Germany, and Argentina will win the World Cup (especially with Brazil missing Neymar in the final). Looking forward to a terrific Argentina-Holland SF (assuming tonight's matches go according to plan) -- which would be a repeat of the 1978 final.


Although I watched him for the first time, I couldn't help noticing time and again how frail Neymar is for a football player. The refereeing was weird in this game in that no yellow cards came out for most of the match and there were suddenly a few. Neymar's hit not even being carded was a gross oversight. Get will soon Neymar, Brazil is going to miss you and Silva.

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Re: FIFA World Cup 2014, Brazil

Postby ssp » Sat Jul 05, 2014 6:14 am

Would like to see an Argentina v Brazil final as well, but both need to raise their game to get there.
Brazil were awful in the 2nd half. They needed someone in midfield and up front simply to keep the ball, but Fred, Hulk, Neymar and Oscar kept losing possession. I really can't see what Scolari sees in Fred and Hulk. The latter could have put the game out of reach at half time if he had some composure in front of goal. Fred is worse than useless. He contributed nothing, fell over most of the time and usually got in the way of his teammates. Even Serginho (of the wonderful 1982 team) looked like a gazelle in comparison to this guy.
Neymar will be a big miss. However, Scolari needs to change to 4-3-3 . Gustavo, Fernandinho and Hernanes should make up the midfield and Oscar, Willian and Hulk or Jo should be the forwards.
James Rodriguez is some player.Just went past people so easily. Shame we won't be seeing more of him.

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Re: FIFA World Cup 2014, Brazil

Postby Prashant » Sat Jul 05, 2014 12:56 pm

The referee in the Brazil-Colombia game was a disgrace. Should have sent the Spanish referees home with the players. I don't mean that he was biased, just incompetent. He let a host of really rash challenges go unpunished all through, by both teams. James Rodriguez was pretty unceremoniously hacked down 3-4 times in the first 20 minutes of the game, and both Colombian wing backs were guilty of some really meaty tackles on Neymar.

Thiago Silva I have little sympathy for though. He came in carrying a yellow & made a completely bone-headed challenge on the Colombian keeper. It was a completely justified yellow.

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Re: FIFA World Cup 2014, Brazil

Postby arjun2761 » Sat Jul 05, 2014 5:52 pm

I expect Brazil to handle Germany pretty easily despite the loss of Neymar. Individually, the Brazilians are much more skilled than the Germans although the Germans are more organized and they will have to hope for a mistake (or a choke) from the Brazilians to get through. With Neymar being out, the Brazilian attack will be more diversified and may turn out to be better than what they've shown so far.

Argentina is a much more of a 1 man team dependent on Messi. With him in they should make the finals but they would have little chance without him.

Hopefully, dark horse Costa Rica can take out the favored Netherlands.

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Re: FIFA World Cup 2014, Brazil

Postby Sin Hombre » Sat Jul 05, 2014 6:06 pm

Not sure you are serious there arjun about Brazil having better players individually.

Brazil's team is a bunch of hacks who are making the most of home refereeing.

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Re: FIFA World Cup 2014, Brazil

Postby ssp » Sat Jul 05, 2014 7:44 pm

Not sure you are serious there arjun about Brazil having better players individually.


The players that Scolari favours-Hulk, Fred, Jo, Paulinho- are awful, but the ones on the bench-Willian, Bernard, Hernanes- would lift the standard of this Brazilian team, but compared to most teams of the past, this one is embarrassingly bad. I didn't think they were too clever in the Confederations Cup last either, but Neymar's goals carried them through and Fred was able to run (a little bit) then and just happened to finish off some nice moves. Paulinho and Oscar could pass and score last year, but have been rubbish at the WC. Scolari's tactics are pretty crude too. he wants his teams to foul in midfield and disrupt the opposition's flow. He doesn't care how his teams win.

Germany are methodical as usual, but we can point to some of their weaknesses too. They lack pace at the back, they play without a CF (Klose is their version of Fred), their back 4 are all central defenders, Ozil is not at his best etc. They didn't look too clever against Ghana or Algeria. It just seems as if Brazil are judged by higher standards 9given their illustrious history), yet Germany are not criticized for their dull displays. No one knows what will happen on the day.

If Brazil keep their composure (and not hack the ball away idiotically) and not get too emotional, they have every chance of beating the Germans. I would like them to put in a decent performance and show a different game plan where they are not reliant on everything revolving around Neymar. Personally, Thiago Silva's loss will be greater, because Willian is a decent replacement. I also think most teams are a bit nervous of playing Brazil and tend to go too defensive.

Argentina played somewhat better than their previous 4 games. Their intensity was much better and they never really allowed Belgium any clear chances. I'm hoping both South American teams can make the final.
Last edited by ssp on Sat Jul 05, 2014 8:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: FIFA World Cup 2014, Brazil

Postby Prashant » Sat Jul 05, 2014 7:58 pm

Dante will replace Thiago Silva and that is not a huge dropoff in talent, but perhaps in leadership ability it is.

I don't know who will replace Neymar - you seem to assume it is Willian, who would be my pick too, but I doubt that's who big Phil will field.

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Re: FIFA World Cup 2014, Brazil

Postby arjun2761 » Sun Jul 06, 2014 12:29 am

Sin Hombre wrote:Not sure you are serious there arjun about Brazil having better players individually.

Brazil's team is a bunch of hacks who are making the most of home refereeing.


Yes, I am serious. Your characterization of Brazil being of a bunch of hacks is pretty laughable. I believe they command the highest transfer fees in the European leagues where you would expect European players getting better deals. Also, in last years Confederations cup final, they stream rolled Spain 3-0 at a time when Spain was thrashing everyone else in Europe.

I agree with SSP's analysis in that these Brazilians are being sold short in the media as they lack the flair of some of the previous Brazilian teams but on the other hand this is a grittier team than many of the previous teams which were brilliant but brittle. On an individual level, most of the Brazilians will win the one-on-one battles with the Germans and given that this team isn't as brittle, I expect them to win comfortably in the SF.

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Re: FIFA World Cup 2014, Brazil

Postby Sin Hombre » Sun Jul 06, 2014 5:36 am

Comparing Fred to the all-time top scorer in the world cup is what is laughable. Or is looking at transfer fees as any kind of indication given at the higher end, they reflect commercial value (David Luiz as the most expensive defender in the world is the most extreme example given his lack of actual defensive abilities) more than actual ability. Or partly that Brazilian players are more happy playing in the backwaters of Russia or Ukraine for big money. Or looking at beating an over-the-hill Spanish team as any kind of accomplishment given they lost 5-1 to an average Dutch squad in a more important competition.

SSP did make a valid point of the German backline comprising of all CBs but that is more a reflection on Löw being an idiot and trying to play the best fullback of his generation in midfield in a foolish attempt to ape Guardiola.

No top club in the world would ever take the Hulks, Freds and Paulinhos over even the 3rd choice German player in the same position.

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Re: FIFA World Cup 2014, Brazil

Postby ssp » Sun Jul 06, 2014 6:44 am

Comparing Fred to the all-time top scorer in the world cup is what is laughable


Klose is 36 and hasn't got the pace to lead the attack. He may have a great record, but he has never been a brilliant striker and didn't look too clever in the QF. Klose was as ineffective as Fred, but Low had the common sense to replace him in the QF. Scolari didn't in their QF. Also, both countries must have better options who have been overlooked. That's what I meant about Klose being the German 'version' of Fred.

Brazil should have been 3-0 up in both 1st halves in the knockout games, if they had a quality strikers instead of Fred and Hulk.Their 2nd half displays in both games have been dire. Instead, Hulk contrived to set up the Chilean goal!

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Re: FIFA World Cup 2014, Brazil

Postby prashanthm » Tue Jul 08, 2014 9:56 pm

Brazil has been absolutely thrashed by the Germans 7-1.... Huge confidence booster for Germany going into the final....

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Re: FIFA World Cup 2014, Brazil

Postby ssp » Tue Jul 08, 2014 11:32 pm

Brazil got found out and were hammered within first 30 mins. Joke defence, no midfield and Fred and Hulk found another player matching their 'ability' in Bernard. Germany' were brilliant and could have had 2-3 more. It was all too easy for them. They just closed the gaps in their own half, waited for a poor Brazilian touch or pass (which happened every single time), then with 1-2 touch passes got the ball to the flanks and their midfielders sprinted up to join Klose and were often 3 v 1 in front of the Brazilian keeper.
I am wondering if our hockey players secretly played for Brazil tonight. Same lunatic defending and abject surrender. Same men v boys scenario or perhaps men v infants. ;)

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Re: FIFA World Cup 2014, Brazil

Postby Sin Hombre » Tue Jul 08, 2014 11:45 pm

Humble pie for arjun and ssp ;)

As I said before, Brazil are a bunch of hacks (+Thiago Silva and Neymar) and Germany is much the superior team (especially the ludicrous and laughable claim that Brazil was better man-on-man).

Anyone who follows club football regularly, and not just internationals, would say the same.


Also 36 year Klose >>>>> Fred

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Re: FIFA World Cup 2014, Brazil

Postby PKBasu » Wed Jul 09, 2014 7:24 am

What an absolute battering for Brazil. Surely the most sensational result in any World Cup match ever! (The BBC had it as its lead World News story all morning today, quite appropriately!).

I am a Brazil fan, so I was a bit devastated. I don't follow club football at all, and usually just follow the World Cup (catching up along the way). This time, I haven't had much time to watch too many matches (what with Wimbledon on at the same time!), so I was a real arm-chair observer! My pet theory had always been that the European sides can't play in Latin America -- so this had to be a Brazil-Argentina final. But somehow, from the first days of this World Cup, Holland and Germany (those two great hockey-playing nations too!!) seem intent on proving my theory completely wrong. They have done something to acclimatize much better to Brazilian conditions than any other European side (now or in the past).

Of course, we will never know how much of a difference Neymar and Thiago Silva would have made, but Germany were truly devastatingly brilliant (and this was one match I did see, at least through the first half and toward the end of the second half) -- while Brazil's defense was a lot like Indian hockey teams' in recent decades! I was reminded of Montreal 1976 and that horrible 6-1 shellacking by Australia, from which we have never quite recovered! (Brazil, though, will surely recover -- but must know that they need more depth on their bench; in 1962, when Pele was injured out early, Garrincha and his team-mates rose to the challenge and still brought back the Cup; this time, either the Germans and Dutch have become a lot better, or Brazil simply did not have a talented-enough team).


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